At the end of Eldest, Christopher made it obvious that Murtagh and Eragon were brothers, considering how Murtagh himself said they were and that Selena was his mother as well lol. Although, what if possibly, there was an affair? Even though it says they are brothers...I can't help but feel that Brom is his father, or even more so, maybe Galbatorix. It would make a good twist to the plot for Eragon to be devestated finding out Morzan is his father, as he did in Eldest, and then find out later it was not really true, that the man he grew to love basically, Brom, was really his father, or even worst...Galbatorix, the man he hated the most of all people.

Brom was obviously around where Morzan lived for a bit you would think, considering he killed him and all. Also, I don't remember the exact details, but I know Brom spoke of a love he had, but didn't seem to want to talk about much, and I don't believe he gave a name. While he was around for Morzan...possibly an affair? That would explain as to why she ran off to have Eragon born, think how Morzan would react to find out the kid born wasn't his, if somehow he could of found out. Of course obviously she ran away so he wouldn't be raised by Morzan, seeing how his temper was with Murtagh (Example: Murtaghs gash in his back).

Galbatorix...I don't really think this is it...but I think it could be possible. Not saying Selena could consent to him, but seeing as how Galbatorix is, he could get any women he wants cause simply if they didn't do his bidding hehe, he could just kill them, you know? Been awhile since I read Eragon, but wasn't Selena said to be really beautiful? All the more reason for Galbatorix to desire her. Just throwing out an idea.

Although technically, my topic wouldn't be completly true if this were the case. Because either way, Morzan being his father or not being his father, Selena is still his mother. So really they would be half-brothers...but I'm meaning here is like full brothers or whatever, born of the same mother and father.

Anybody agree possibly?

what? he says it in the book. r u blind u nead to read the ending again flying blind bat(just playing). but murtagh says they r brothers and i beleave him even though he is evil and get stabed but not killed

Heeeeeeeello? It clearly states, in the text, that both Eragon and Murtagh's mom is Selena. Isn't that proof enough? Much less the fact that Murtagh was told by Galbatorix that both he and Eragon's father is Morzon.[/i]

i sorta see what eragon 128 is saying cuz i mean it would make sense.

you guys dont need to freak out on 'im it was just an idea

and he also says it in the Ancent Launguage That they are Brothers , and you know you cant lise then.

well if they have different fathers then they would still be brothers but only half brothers plus maybe murtagh dosen't kno that their 1/2 bros (if it is true that they r 1/2 bros)

in the book it sed that selena wuz both of their mothers but i think that Galbatorix only assumed that since selena & morzon were married that eragon wuz his son & 2 my knowlede i don't think that murtagh ever actaualy sed that morzon wuz eragons father but he sed but i haven't read the book in a while so i'm not positive.

but yea i have been pondering this thougght alot latly like i think that selena had a afair with brom & i think thats y he moved 2 carvahall because his son was their i mean brom & eragon connected so much & they were both rlly good swordsmen & both of theri dragons were named saphira i don't think that it is Galbatorix whose his faher but it is still very possible

I agree with eragon52, it really does make sense! If you think about it...

I personally think that Brom's great love could be the elf's queen and I would'n be surprised if Arya is their child.

With Eragon, I would bet that his father is Galbatorix. Still, I just can'n wait for the third book!

I had a similar idea, notice how attached Brom was to Selena??? He said he knew her enough to miss her when she was gone...I had the same theory on other sight, that murtagh and eragon are half brothers.

[color=red][/color]I think Eragon And Mortagh are not brouthers because they are so differn't

they are similar...they have the same mother for sure

yea maybe they r half brothers

I said that....

yea i know and i was just saying that i agree

the posibilities are...
1. they're half brother (same mother, different father)
2. they're brothers (same mother, same father)
I go for posibility number one.

I agree with possaility #1

That would explain why Brom went to Carvahall of all places.and yea he said he knew selena enogh to miss her when she was gone so that is a very definite possibility.

This would also explain why Brom had a ring with the elf symbol on it.

It could be that they're half-brothers, Selena being their mother. However, in the end of Eldest, Eragon tells Nazuada that Murtagh told him of Morzan and Selena in the ancient language. Unless he was twisting his words, how could he lie?

From what i read in Eldest, same dad and same mom. I dont think Morzan was a sleeze lol

you know how in the aienchent launguage you dont have to tell the complete truth only part of it and he knows somthing eragon dosent know

yea i dont know i dont think that murtogh was very percistant with the AL when he told him. So trickery wouldnt be the way.

maybe but he is a rival dragon rider know and eragon couldent probe his mind or else 1. he would be vunerable to murtagh and 2. there are probably defences around his mind so he could of resorted to it but eragon couldent tell

Like when eragon first met murtogh he couldnt even budge his mind barriers but it isnt like murtogh is gunna learn so many words in a few months

exactly he didnt learn them galby used magic to auto memeorize all that stuff

No i dont believe so because if he knew all that galby knew he would be 1.) As powerful and percistant with the AL and 2.) he will know galbys AL name

why would galby allow his name to float into the mind other wise murtagh would have destroyed galby he only gave murtagh a certain amount

Well lets get back to topic here. If he told Eragon in the anchient launguage blankly this "Your my brother or Our dad and mom are the same which he said one in eldest then i dont know how he could lie or decieve him

good point but what im trying to state is that the al can be decived so murtagh may not know hes not telling the full truth

So he could be assuming that they have the same parents because he never said he KNEW they were brothers he only just said it in the AL and also in eragon they bonded like brothers so they could have been decieved by metaphors in the anchient launguage

exactley

coo lol we agree on something because that sounds plausible

There is a link. A very important link between Selena and Brom. We are not given any other details as of how well Brom knew Selena. but there is something there. It would be WONDERFUL if Brow was Eragon's father as he depics everything the "Little One" admires in one. I do recall Brom saying something about Garrow not teaching Eragon to read or something of the sort. The relationship between Eragon and Brom was a special one indeed and this was so deep and emotive when Eragon and Brom said their goodbyes.

Brom was like eragon's father, but I doubt Brom was eragon's father. Anything is possible, tho.

Heh wasn't he too old (Brom)?

What do we really know about Brom's age? Remember that as a Rider his lfe span was longer than i of other humans. I think of him being Eragon's father maybe just out of wishful thinking. Even though I believe in the saying of "The child needs not be the same as the father." There is another one that says "The apple never falls far from the tree." We cannot even say this about Murtag. I don't believe him to be as evil as Morzan, just that the bewithcment is too strong for him to break all by his own.

Murtagh maybe isn't so evil like his father but as well as Eragon he has a dragon so its true that The apple didn't falls far from tree

murtagh is under galby control

I was offline for about 2 or 3 weeks since I moved and got my DSL today, ever since I have been scanning for new thoughts and theories. I also, finally, bought both books to look up things. The more I read and the more I listen to the CD's, the more I re-affirm my belief that Brom was Eragon's father and not Morzan.
In Eldest, when Blagden comes to Eragon and gives him his infamous riddles he says"Son and father alike, both as blind as bats." (page 546) Eragon calls Blagden and asks him if he knew who his father was. The raven in turn answers:
" While two may share two, (while Brom and Morzan may share two, that is Murtag and Eragon share the same mother)
And one of two is certainly one, [(this could go either way) one of two, one of the two brothers, is certainly one, is certainly one son of Mortag OR one son of Brom]
One might be two, ( the one might be parent of the two, Selena??)

I am not, and never have been good at solving riddles, but I have thought long and hard on this one. I may be wrong, but it is a lot of fun to try to solve the mystery. Any thoughts???

i agree u got alot of evidence

My brother and I are different, they don't have to be the same, but I get what Eragon128 is saying.

there not different their equal at swordsmanship and WERE good friends

On the contrary. The book mentions that both Eragon and Murtag had a lot in common (besides the same Mom). Page 284 of Eragon says: "The days rolled by unnoticed as their small group traveled in isolation. Eragon was pleased to find that he and Murtag shared many of the same interests; they spent hours debating the finer points of archery and hunting.'

they are at least have bros and they are alike.

Being different is not proof of kinship. How many friends do you have that you feel are more kin to you than blood brothers & sisters? So getting along well cannot have that big weight in this.

mabe eragon took after his mom and mertag after his dad.

I agree with you, but who really knows. I know Eragon is brave, noble, sensitive, hard working and humble. All this may be because of the upbringing he received from Garrow & his wife.

On the other hand, Murtagh is brave, suspicious, not very sensitive and high on protecting his life. Again this may be due to the pain, hurt and suffering he had to endure while growing up the way Morzan had determined. Not too much contact with Selena, harsh and cruel dad.

Oh I dislike that slimeball sooo much! (Morzan, not Murtagh)

Murtagh I think is a victim of his life's circumstances.

So why do you call him member of slimeball and why do you dislike him. You should cry over his sad life and deplore him

Incomer, I think you skipped this line, hon:


Oh I dislike that slimeball sooo much! (Morzan, not Murtagh)

yes I skopped it...sorry

MY pleasure, that's what grown ups are for; to remind you teens what you may overlook!

OK, that was me being snotty!


OUT OF TOPIC, AGAIN!

i konw that its not polite and i hope you take no offense, but how old are you ms. AnnieBee?

ok. first off, but far fetched. could there not be more than one woman name salena?(iknow this won't be the turn out though)
secondly. the twins assomed morzan fathered both just because of salena. they had no other factss to go on. and, it was just the name because eragon never met his mother.
thirdly i agree with a possible affair. if salena left and hooked up with brom and realized she was pregnant she probably got scared. she could have hidden the affair with her defences he gave her, but with a baby, i'm sure there would have been something in his head to tell morzan he wasn't the father. so she went to her brothers to have the baby, then reaturned to morzan to keep it a secret. otherwise morzan may have found eragon looking for her. so she went back to protect him.
forthly. brom did have many other places to go. you may ask why then didn't he get more involed with eragon, or tell him when he became a rider. but you have to consider brom was a logical thinker. he probably didn't want to get too close when eragon was a baby in order to protect them both. (he was in hideing after all) but also because he knew he could be called away at any moment because of the egg. as far as not telling him once he became a rider. he probably didn't want to distract him. he knew eragon was dealing with a lot allready, and that there would be a lot expected of him. he couldn't let this get in the way of training. whether you think thats a good reason for you or not. think about it from broms point. like i said, he is logical.

well that's enough for me right now. sorry it's so long. hope you like some of my ideas.
p.s. let me know if i got something wrong catch you later.

I'll PM you! I don't want to scare you guys by making it public!!!! LOL!!

Brom is Eragon's true father for several clues do give us some reason to belive this.

First off Murtagh saying Morzan is Eragon's father in the AL, dosen't matter, as long as you say something you belive to be true then you can say it in the AL(Read about Eragon's poem at the Elven ceremony in Eldest). If their mother was Selena then why wouldn't they have the same father.

Also, Blagden the crow in his crazy riddles gives us three clues.

Riddle #1

By beak and bone,
Mine blackened stone
Sees rooks and crooks
And bloody brooks!

Rook is a not the chess peice but an old world bird. Remember all the birds waiting to feast on the dead during the last battle in Eldest.

Crooks is talking about Murtagh stealing Zar'roc from Eragon.

Bloody Brooks is the Jiet River as Elain and Murtagh look down from the ship to see the river red with blood.

After Eragon could not solve this Blagden caws and gives his second riddle.

Riddle #2

“Son and Father alike, both blind as bats”.

This is by far the easiet of the riddles. It is just talking about both Brom and Eragon being blind to the betrayls of the two people they looked up to. Brom being betrayed by Morzan and Eragon by Murtagh.

Riddle #3

While two may share two,
And one of two is certainly one,
One might be two.

While two may share two(Eragon and Murtagh sharing the same parents in Morzan and Selena)

And one of two is certainly one(Selena is the for sure parent of both Eragon and Murtagh)

One might be two(This is meaning that instead of one father their might be two: Brom and Morzan)

Lastly, look at the facts. Murtagh and Morzan both have red dragons and while we know Murtaghs is named Thorn, we don't know Morzan's though we could assume it is the same. Then look at Brom and Eragon both having blue female dragons named Saphira. Also, Brom's tutor comments on how much like Brom, Eragon is.Finnally, there is Angela's comment about Brom's fate. She says he was fated to love a woman and that was to be her downfall. You could assume that by loving Selena then Morzan finds out and kills her.

i agree with A LOT you said, but just to point out, cp never said brom's saphira was blue.
...although i think she was.

Hmmm.....I could have sworn it said they were of the same color, but I could be wrong. I think I may have read it in an interview of CP, have to look it up. Though with the name Saphira which is basically Sapphire(blue), it does make sense for them to have the same color and they both are females.

Whoa that is a good point up their that you posted F'lar05

Thank you much, but I don't take all the credit. I did figure out one of the theorys and the color similiarities of dragons between the fathers and sons but I used alot of other theorys I found surfing the web. If you have anything to add or argue agianst please do.

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I cannot remember in what thread I included it, but I also tried to decipher Blagden's riddle. We have many common points, but not all.
I continue to be of the belief that Brom is Eragon's father.

If you could would you post how you deciphered it please.

Absolutely; I tried looking where was it that I did do it but couldn't find it.

While two may share two, While two (Morzan and Brom) share two (the two share a child (Murtagh and Eragon) with Selena.
And one of two is certainly one, And one of the two, (Murtag and Eragon) is certainly one, (Eragon is Brom's son, and Murtag's is Morzan's son so they are each son of a one)
One might be two. (Eragon, as Brom's son he may be a descendent of the first Eragon so he shares the lineage of the of them both.)

Wow that's kind of confusing. It does make sense except I don't agree with the last line. Something another person possted about on another site made me agree with there could be time travel in the third book. I don't think it will happen, but CP does use alot of other writers ideas in his plots and I could see him using a fav. series of his Dragon Riders of Pern's dragon's abilites to use time travel. In his statement he said that Eragon1 was the son of Eragon2 and Arya. I'll try to get a link for it to let you all read it in more detail.

WOW! But then we would need to do a timeline of events starting with the battles between dragons and elves. Even without the timeline, we learned that Ayra is only about 100 yrs old.

That is a good point, but does it really say in the book that Brom's Saphira was blue? If so, I stand corrected. Very nice dechiphering teq.

You know now that I think of it I am not sure. I guess we have all assumed that Brom's dragon was blue because the name is directly related to sapphires which are blue!

No it dosen't state it, but I do think CP said something about it in an interview. I do think it is blue though for the name. You really couldn't have a gold dragon named Saphira could you?

LOL! I totally agree with you!

Glad someone gets it lol.

I hold the hope that Eragon and Murtagh are only half brothers. I really hope Brom IS Eragon's father. I am constantaly trying to decipher who was the "friend" that stole the egg from the Varden. My suspicions go to Selena.

Wow never thought about that. Wonder if it could be true. Gotta take another look at the timeline.

Try re-reading the section in which Ajihad first talks with Eragon once he has arrived at the Varden. I do not have my book at hand so I am not sure if it was here.

There is also a dialogue between Brom ( ) and Eragon where Brom also gives him a vague explantion as how did he come to have Saphira's egg.

I'll do that as soon as I get my book back. Mother snatched it.

Naughty Mami, I gave my daughter a set of the books so that she wouldn't use mine.

Sounds like a good idea there and wow are we off topic lol.

Each time I hear Eragon, I am more convinced that Murtagh and him are only half-brothers. After this last hearing, I am inclined to believe that Selena had to do an important part with the theft of Saphira's egg.

Might be and we will find out. It never does say who stole the egg though I do think the thief was mentioned to be male.

Again that's the beauty of CP's wrinting. You are correct. He never gives a gender to the thief. He always refers to them as a "friend" or as the "thief".
I mean, how did Angela know about Murtagh if his birth was kept a secret for all?
How did Ajhad know about Murtagh's scar? I think that as Brom's "girlfriend" she may have given him insightful information and arrange for the theft..
How else did Brom manage to hide in a room and "search and look" inside the crates and boxes and a huge and well guarded castle and by chance find the egg?
These are some of the thoughts Marie and I shared during our discussion. What do you think about it?

I agree she could have been a spy, but not the thief. I don't think Brom would have wanted her in that much danger and she could have had spells put on her for just such an occasion.

Remember, Selena was no inept flimsy lady. She had been taught magic by Morzan. And as Murtagh tells us, she was so proficient at it that when she disappeared, not even Galbatorix could find her. There is a BIG, huge blank space there. We know she finished her pregnancy at Carvahall, but what did she do in between the times Morzan was out in his expeditions for Galbatorix?

Don't remember one thing she died after Eragons birth or just dissapeard?

She disappeared for Eragon's birth from Morzan's castle and shortly after she returned she died.

Correct Annie. To many people think she is still alive for some reason.

My computer is giving me such a hard time, I'm about to SHOUT!!! How is it that people think Selena is still alive? But then again, with CP still working on the book, you never know!
Can you imagine what a twist that would be? Selena alive and she can tell if Brom or Morzan was Eragon's real father!!! Sweet!

It would, but then it would raise to many questions. Oromis or Saphira will be the one to tell him and it will probably happen soon in the third book, when he arrives to complete his training. Like the final goodbye between master and apprentice.

Honestly, I do not for a minute believe Selena is alive. Brom would have known.

Yes, and remember Brom said he knew enought to miss her when she was gone. This indicates she is dead

I agree with you

There is no way CP will make Galbatorix the father. Just as he wouldn't have made Morzan the true father. He has already followed a Star Wars plotline and I am glad he has started to deviate from that story line. That is why Brom is the true father.

On this one, I am going by the book. The reference is to the conversation Murtagh and Eragon have once they were locked up after their arrival at Farthern Dûr.
This is Eragon, pages 388-9

"I would have grown to manhood in this fashion if Morzan hadn't been summoned away to hunt for Saphira's egg. (So the egg had been stolen and the seach was in full force.)
As soon as he departed, my mother vanished. No one knows where she went, or why. (Could it be that at this point she knew she was pregnant?)
The king tried to hunt her down, but his men couldn't find her trail─no dobut because Morzan's training." (She was an excellent student to cover her trace so thoroughly, and I think it was she who taught Murtagh to close and protect his mind.)

A paragraph after he continues:

"However, before word of Morzan's and the others' deaths reached us, my mother returned." (To what I understand, she had already given birth to Eragon)
Many months had passed since she disappeared. (On page 19, Eragon tells us that Selena stayed in Carvahall for five months until he was born.)
Her health was poor, as if she had suffered a great illness, and she grew steadily worse. (If this was due to a complicated delivery or pure depression due to having to give up her child and Brom, we do not know. No more information is given.)
Within a fortnight, she died. (So in a span of fourteen days she died.)

You would need to analyze the opening post in light of this information and come up with your conclusions.

But in Eldest Eragon can read his poem in the Acient Language because he BELEIVES it to be true. Obviously Murtagh beleives they are brothers as well. But I do think they AT LEAST share the same mother.

they r brothers

how couldnt they be

Some ppl, like me, hope or believe that they had Selena for a mother but different fathers. I think Brom was his father, but that's for a different topic.

it does clearly state in the text that they are brothers but it is quite possable that there was an affair of somesort that made them 1/2 brothers, it would make a good plot for the next book

Yes, Galbatorix, the Twins and Murtagh himself, all believe Morzan fathered Eragon and Murtagh, however, there are many clues that indicate the possibility of them being half brtohers.